Surely there needs to be an Indie Teenpop Award

[koganbot]

Surely there needs to be an Indie Teenpop Award. Eligible for the award will be: (1) performers who are going for a teenpop sound but are on indies or who are strictly MySpace or CDbaby, (2) performers who are somewhat or formerly teenpop but are also going for a somewhat indie sound, whether they're on indies or not, (3) performers who are not necessarily eligible under 1 and 2 but whom we talked about on the teenpop thread for who knows what reason and who aren't obviously too old or too NOT teenpop and who can be rationalized as having indie elements or who just, you know, seem eligible.

Also, they need to be pretty good. You can be teenpop by association. You can be indie by association. I've put qualifying criteria after the performers' name.

These are potential nominees, but I will hear arguments as to who else should qualify and who else should be disqualified. Here's a list:

Lily Allen (3)
Fefe Dobson (1)**
Flyleaf (3)
Jonas Bros. (2)
Jena Kraus (3)
Marit Larsen (2)
Brie Larson (2)
Lillix (2)
Megan McCauley (2)
Meg & Dia (1)(2)
Hope Partlow (1)**
Marion Raven (1)*
Sammy & Sasha (1)
Skye Sweetnam (2)
Lucy Woodward (1)(2)

Some of these should be bumped by performers who are more obviously eligible. I decided that Jonas Bros.' kiddie-punk tendencies and the fact that they're promoted by Girlie Action make them eligible until we can find someone more eligible. I decided that the fact that Megan McCauley was so obviously goth up to 2 minutes ago makes her a wee bit indie, but she is quite bumpable as well. Probably all the others in category 2 are bumpable except Brie, and the category 3's as well. It's hard to argue that Marit is teenpop anymore, though she has the pedigree. And Flyleaf's teenpopness can be challenged, and Skye's and Lillix's indieness (though I don't know how secure Lillix's status is at Warners, now that Maverick is no more).

skyecaptain will most likely provide more nominees.

*Yup, Marion is on an indie; she broke with Atlantic, who never released her album in the U.S., where she now lives. E.P. due in about a week, alb due next year.

**Getting dropped by your label makes Fefe indie, I'd say, or at least the fact that she has no label and her unreleased music is being bandied about the Net. But I'm not counting Christina Milian since I'm assuming she'll make her way back to a major, and her music is out there on a major. I don't know if I should count Hope Partlow, either, since the only music we know of hers came from a major label and I don't know if she's got any new current music. In January she said, "I needed to get out of the house so I got a job! I'm a waitress at a local restaurant!! I'm really loving it!" In March she said, "I will be back on tour, hopefully to promote a brand new album."

I will decide a final list of contestants sometime or other. There will probably be 12, unless there are 16. I don't know when I will actually get around to this.

Comments

Second Stage at the Indie Awards

[skyecaptain.livejournal.com]

Second stagers are the Myspace finds who aren't quite ready for big-time indie, the club league to indie's minor league: Katie Neil, Colette Trudeau, Shut Up Stella, Bec Hollcraft, a few others. Maybe shemo group Paramore.

As for the rest of the awards, I would include for consideration Fan_3 (unless Shut Up Stella counts as her only representation), Kristy Frank, Dahv, Alexandra Slate, Damone (by rule 2 and I think 3), Girl Authority (is Rounder indie enough?), Go Betty Go, Courtney Jaye, Daphne and Celeste, Rose Falcon (maybe 2, plus the Dobson-Partlow handicap -- Melissa Lefton has a double handicap, right?). Does Toy-Box count? Oh, and Leslie Carter counts for this now.

I wouldn't count Jonas Brothers, but there need to be more boys on the list. Of the 3's, I'd probably only count Flyleaf...Jena could make it on personality and indieness (commenting on your own review is bonus points in both categories) but Lily was considered for the Mercury awards, which would make her nomination here redundant.

My top twelve would go something like: Skye, Fefe, Lillix, Brie, Marit, Marion, Hope, Meg and Dia, Daphne and Celeste, Kristy Frank, Dahv, Fan_3, Katie Neil, Colette Trudeau, Shut Up Stella (woop, second stage gate-crashed). Leslie Carter lurking at 13.

There could be honorary awards for acts who extract themselves from consideration by being too damn indie, like Smoosh and Eyeball Skeleton and Be Your Own Pet. (The Dollyrots might fit here.) Also for extremely unpopular major label artists like Devo 2.0 who never got their due, the I Can't Believe It's Not Indie Award.

You should submit this to Poptimists as a poll, several people could probably name a ton of non-American acts that fit your criteria.

Re: Second Stage at the Indie Awards

[dickmalone.livejournal.com]

Second Daphne and Celeste but I'd say no on BYOP--they're so far toward punk they're barely even indie, really. I mean they're still indie but since this is ostensibly some sort of genre-specific thing I don't know how you could really judge them against the other folks listed. Maybe other people find them poppier?

Re: Second Stage at the Indie Awards

[koganbot]

Well, the question isn't whether something is "too damn indie" - and for our purposes, punk can be indie, since punk helped create indie - but whether it's "too damn not teenpop." And the one song Smoosh song I've heard - "Rad" - makes them eligible, almost Aaron Carterish. They talk about being on soccer teams!

Wait, are Daphne & Celeste still a current act, and are they on an indie? I didn't specify, but the award is for current performers, not for Hall of Famers (and anyway, D&C were major label in the Britland, though nonexistent here). Oh, looking at Wikipedia, there may be tentative plans for doing something, but I couldn't tell if either of the women is really putting much energy into the idea of a reunion. There has to be recent product for the duo to be eligible. "Daphne and Celeste are currently considering a comeback, after top Euro DJ Ötzi released a 2006 mix of 'Ooh Stick You!' This has yet to get a release, however it has had dancefloors bouncing all across Austria."

Re: Second Stage at the Indie Awards

[koganbot]

Also, the fact that Lex made Smoosh his entry (representing the USA) in the Pop World Cup makes them teenpop. I should have listed them. Speaking of Hope, let's not forget Hope 7 (except they're probably not good enough for the top 12/16).

If we can get a good enough list of 12 that excludes Skye and Lillix and Marit, I would be happy. Flyleaf are borderline for being not teenpop enough, and adding that to the fact that they're now major label probably should make them ineligible - their album is on Octone, the promo said it was distributed by Sony BMG but Billboard didn't seem to concur, but now they've signed a joint deal with Octone, J Records, and RCA, the latter of which is owned by Sony BMG.

Re: Second Stage at the Indie Awards

[skyecaptain.livejournal.com]

Yeah, I guess D&C is hall of fame for all intents and purposes. By "too damn indie" I did, in fact, mean "too damn not teenpop" (with Smoosh kinda borderline).

Re: Second Stage at the Indie Awards

[poptasticuk.livejournal.com]

D&C are definitely not a current act and I think they were major label in the UK at least.

Katy Katy Katy

[koganbot]

Wait, we totally forgot Katy Rose! 2004 is recent enough, and her best beats even Skye's and Lillix's best!

What about Cathy Davey? I'd guess that she isn't teen or pop enough.

[dubdobdee.livejournal.com]

do you need someone to make this into an actual real poll at some point?

[koganbot]

Yeah, but not for a while as I'm procrastinating like crazy working against deadline on a Platinum Weird piece. I want input from Poptimists and from the teenpop thread before we come up with a final list. skyecaptain doesn't know this yet, but he and I are going to create the list together, as he knows the territory better than I. I might want to take the poll to Poptimists if there's ever a lull in their festivities. Maybe we'd have YouTube and MySpace links for every contestant, and write-ups, as in the Pop World Cup.

[koganbot]

By the way, I'm totally comfortable with the idea that there are absolutely zero good male teenpop acts at the moment, major or indie. Haven't heard any Ashley Parker Angel except the single. He seems to be the only real candidate, though I do think there's reasonably good stuff on the Jonas Bros. album. I heard an OK Westlife song once. Busted are Busted, and from what I've heard weren't any better than the Jonas Bros. are. Jesse McCartney has his merits. If we count current emo, which is the real male teenpop, well, um... I think I'm still coming up w/ zero. Maybe continental Europe can help us out.

[skyecaptain.livejournal.com]

Racking my brain for boys and all I can come up with are a very select handful of Myspacers, almost all of whom aren't very good...Disney has had some funny kid-rap boy entries in their incubaTor series, Lil' Josh prude-rap; Lil' J Xavier is Prince of the South, 2Krayze sez "STAY IN SCHOOL"; 3D has a 3D party...in fact, you could pull a lot of potential candidates from there, almost all of them are indie. (There are exceptions, like Cheyenne Kimball and Emma Roberts.)

Katy Rose! Definitely counts and takes the place of D&C on my list.

[poptasticuk.livejournal.com]

This is all a bit American! I'll have to think up some UK/Euro acts for you. All I can think of so far is Lambretta (brilliant) and Tokio Hotel (awful), who are both teen-rock bands with teenage singers.

[koganbot]

Both Lambretta (which broke up) and Tokio Hotel are on major labels. Is there anything indie about either of them, other than Tokio Hotel's black nails (which I'd assume would be glam, not indie)?

I've heard one song by Tokio Hotel, "Durch den Monsun," which I think is a very pretty guitar ballad, the sound feels singer-songwriter romantic, would be one of the best songs on Radio Disney should it ever get there. But I'm prejudiced in its favor because the version I've heard/seen has Gang Oscypa lipsynching to it, and Gang Oscypa are wonderful. This is the first I've heard of Lambretta.

[(Anonymous)]

They are more alternative than indie, I suppose - an alternative to traditional pure pop teenpop. I know Lambretta broke up but Linda, the singer, will continue with a solo career, apparently in the style of Gwen Stefani although I'm sure she'll bring an ace Swedish twist to it.

[poptasticuk.livejournal.com]

Oops, that was me.

[koganbot]

OK, following your links, I perceive that Lambretta has goth-metal tendencies and Tokio Hotel rock tendencies, but I still don't see that these allow us to call them indie teenpop.

[poptasticuk.livejournal.com]

I'll have to try harder then.

Lil Chris?

[koganbot]

Is this guy on an indie label? He seems plenty eligible for the Indie Teenpop award.

Re: Lil Chris?

[poptasticuk.livejournal.com]

He's on RCA so not indie, but I guess his sound is sort of. I don't like him though, the song's rubbish.

Re: Lil Chris?

[skyecaptain.livejournal.com]

Hm, I would still count this under guideline 2, even though I might never vote for it. I'd heard of him (I think?) but had absolutely no idea it sounded like this! Crazy vibrato, reminds me of Jim Carrey doing Grace Slick in The Cable Guy. Brie Larson just pointed to a kid group doing a cover of "Seven Nation Army." They're called Grak but I haven't found anything else about them. I'm pretty sure they say "hounds of heck."

Re: Lil Chris?

[koganbot]

Well, I find the Lil Chris track irresistable (way more so than Jonas Bros or Busted), but I'll probably declare him ineligible anyway, as I'm eliminating most 2's and 3's (w/exception of Brie, who's a certified commercial flop at this point).

This is sort of where I am at the moment:

Top Candidates???
DaHv
Fefe Dobson
Fan_3
Kristy Frank
Girl Authority
Brie Larson
Meg & Dia
Katie Neil
Marion Raven
Katy Rose
Sammy & Sasha
Alexandra Slate
Shut Up Stella
Smoosh
Colette Trudeau

Probably not good enough (not that I've heard most of these; I'm going by Dave's evaluation)
Leslie Carter
Lil' Josh
Lil' J Xavier
2Krayze
3D
Go Betty Go
Courtney Jaye
Hope 7
Bec Hollcraft


Probably Ineligible
Damone (major label? not teenpop enough?)
Rose Falcon (major label? not teenpop enough?)
Paramore (shemo)
Lucy Woodward (older stuff major label; new stuff not teenpop (and not as good as her old stuff))


Eligibility Contingent Upon Releasing New Material
Hope Partlow

Ineligible (for being too not teenpop or for being too major label) (unless we decide otherwise)
Lily Allen
Flyleaf
Jonas Bros.
Jena Kraus
Marit Larsen
Lillix
Megan McCauley
Skye Sweetnam

(excuse if this turns out to be a duplicate post; lj suddenly is acting like ilX on a poxy fule day)

Re: Lil Chris?

[skyecaptain.livejournal.com]

Just posted about this, I should update a bit. I think I excluded Rose Falcon (actually I may have just listed everybody, but I don't think she makes the cut). Of your ineligibles, I would argue for reinstating Lillix. (1) They sound like the Killers now (major label indie) and (2) they've been at least as big a flop as Brie. I reluctantly accept that Skye probably doesn't count in 2006 (she'd be a shoe-in for the 2004 awards, or even 2005 with a year lag, when production could have qualified her despite being distributed on a major). If one-year lag counts, which I think is reasonable on a case by case basis, I would tentatively include Hope Partlow on the Brie Flop Clause, but tough call.

Of the probably not good enoughs, I only really like Go Betty Go. They're on Side One Dummy, same label that put out Gogol Bordello's last record, and their new album comes out tomorrow. But they have a new lead singer now and everything I know by them is older material, 04/05 (might want to check em out here).

Re: Lil Chris?

[skyecaptain.livejournal.com]

Er, shoo-in.

Re: Lil Chris?

[koganbot]

Did we ever do this poll?

The Grak link is long obsolete, but here's the vid:

Re: Lil Chris?

[koganbot]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9nO-QGn5QYw