Non Bertha Da Blues

[koganbot]

In case you missed it, or were on it originally but haven't stuck around, Tom asked a question over on his lj last week and the conversation is still underway (Sante and Frith and Woods joining in), so I recommend you take a look:

http://freakytigger.livejournal.com/259269.html

How come rock'n'roll didn't trigger the birth of rock criticism? (i.e. why wasn't Crawdaddy or an equiv started in 1957 or 1958?)

And indeed how come swing and jazz didn't start a fanzine culture?

Tom himself posted further thoughts over on tumblr (here and here and here), as did Dave.

Dave: I think that you could make an argument that there's a certain vein of "rock critic-y" critics, of whom "rock criticism" may actually be a side issue (and that means that the Big Thing that they all adhere to is actually _______...), for whom the phrase in bold [From the alliance between hucksterism and self-conscious artistry comes greatness?] is kind of the essence of what they do, or at least a recurring theme. I'm not sure where you'd stick, say, Manny Farber (who detested a lot of the baggage that comes with the phrase "self-conscious artistry") but you might argue that he's at least defending an artistry that emerges from hucksterism; what it allies with is a bit more inscrutable, but the point is that hucksterism has a role. It's not the only thing — cf. Farber's championing of e.g. Michael Snow and Underground Film, though I suppose you could call the structuralists hucksters of sorts, though hucksters who appeal to a bohemian art world. (Or... maybe not? I dunno, I like to think of a huckster streak in the art I like. Not sure why.)

Comments

[dubdobdee.livejournal.com]

i had some brilliant response/theory i meant to contribute to that, but the margin is too small to contain it i have totally forgotten what it was :(

it does feel like more and more actual fascinating factual-historical information is being brought to bear, with the question itself no closer (at all) to being convincingly answered

it also feels like as a topic it would be a great opening chapter to my proposed rockwrite book, if i ever get back to doing anything on that

[freakytigger.livejournal.com]

Simon Frith's answer (as quoted by you) comes pretty close to my intuitive suspicions.

The reason I was asking it was that I'm trying to get to grips with the early Beatles albums - so hopefully some of the material will show up (tangentially at least) in those reviews.

[(Anonymous)]

AK:

This might interest you...from Joe Carducci:

Possibly alot of good things coming together for The New Vulgate of future weeks.

Next week, almost certainly, is David Lightbourne on the lost origins of the rock press in 1960. For the piece, he conducted one of the last interviews with the late Paul Nelson, first rock critic, signer of New York Dolls, fan of Westerns, Coca-Cola and hamburgers.

http://newvulgate.blogspot.com

[koganbot]

Couldn't find the info on Nelson (did he link it?), but liked what Carducci had to say about Walter Brennan and Audie Murphy (seemed to be arguing that a crucial part of the American actin style was created by people who hadn't been trained as actors).